"Think the unthinkable, speak the unspeakable, REACH THE UNREACHABLE". Free yourself to express and expand. I love you.
Very interesting read. How do we overcome that feeling of ownership of another person? That's been a question I haven't found the answer to.
Peace Queen: Ownership is an illusion. If we can deeply recognize that we belong to God and we are here to assist in each other lives, rather if that is friendship, intimacy, relationship, marriage or just the like. We all have a responsibility to those who we've establish our social bonds with. Depending... and I am saying that with flexibility and respect if people who may have a desire to connect with someone sexually or relationally if they are already in a relationship...open and healthy communication must take place first. If both parties are in agreement..then pursue. If one party agrees and the other one does not...you have to ask yourself the reason you got involved with the person in the first place? Meaning the person who wants more in another relationship. Were the lines of communication healthy from the start? We all get with people for various reason but is the intentions with those people we have established with...know the root causes?
If you have a deep energetic connection with several people I personally would not look at that as "cheating". I am not referring to sex (that's another dynamic... that should be discussed before going forward) with these people but an emotional bond that may be needed in times of "crisis or challenges". We are here on this blue marble for a number of reasons..to realize our destiny. Who am I to say that you belong to me... when the air I breathe is a gift... just like people... circumstances etc. I am just passing through... so let me get the most out of my lessons so I can be a enlightened soul in this life and the next.
well i am often torn on the same topic i think first we should decide what works for us get to the bottom of ourselves and our desires and then attempt to attact that or those people into our lives who are similiar, but the one thing that i think always gets lost is choice. if we can be open and honest with ourselves about whats going on to give the other people in our life a choice to agree ,feel the same ,walk away or what have you but give them the same choices we desire and most times thats when we have a problem.
I totally agree...it is about what works for that individual and from there you attract like-minded people.
Well to truly love someone is to release them and not hold on to them. And not to have an attachment to anything or anyone. Live completely in the now!! Now, Ownership of a process or a group is about being Team versus being on a Team. If i am an OWNER then I approach a process with power and love as opposed to the person who is a renter. Are you renting your lover or are you an Owner in the process. Does renting change your commitment or does Ownership have you committed without a back door? Do I own my partner HELL NO but am I an OWNER of the experience and contribute fully to the Creation? You decide!! LOVE YA!!!
Love is not about possession. There is something very profound in honoring the disires of the other person, however, so long as it doesn't mean compromising your own values. Surama, you said something quite interesting! You said when you resisted sexual impulses, you gave in anyway and the impuse became stronger. That was a matter of choice on your part. If you successfully resist the impulse, doesn't the discipline within you become stronger? Its quite dangerous to the psyche to validate such behaviors by thinking the result justifies the means.
I think that we should note the difference in resistance and choice. When I resisted, it was not out of an intelligent choice. It was because I was told that "God" would be angry with me if I "sinned" and had sex. I resisted out of fear, out of a desire to please those who were responsible for the flock and our immortal souls. In my resistance, sex it self became my anti-christ and therefore took up more space than Christ himself. I would worry. And that gets you no where. If I had chosen to be celibate that is different. There would have been a greater goal in my mind than simply avoiding Hell's fire! I could have said, I chose not to be sexually active because I want to conserve chi force, or simply because I chose. That would generate discipline. So I agree that it was my choice to have sex but my resisting my choice to honor someone else's ideal was folly and did not work for me. I would ask at which point did I support the statement the "result justifies the means"?
If we put aside the fears that are pressed into us from religion, we will find that the universe seemingly presents situations that toss us from side to side, from one perspective to another (usually extremes) all to try to bring us to a place of balance within our perspectives. I'm not saying that galling limitations should ever be perservered in at all. That goes totally against what I believe. I also am not saying that living solely to honor someone else is honorable at all. Self-degradation as a means of making progress only results in throwing yourself away. What I am saying is that as youth and as individuals we very innocently and without effort develop visions of our lives. Through living and acculturation, we find ourselves socializing within structures, even as small as the family unit, that press upon us another set of beliefs, just like the church did. We can't take for granted anything that goes on within us as we experiences these many forms of relating and the
-philosophies, lifestyles etc. that they present to us as possibilities. This is a continuation of the tossing to and fro that we experience. Through this various relational experiences, we have a tendency to adopt another belief, philosopy, value or whatever may come. Yes, it is indeed a part of the evolution process. Reconnecting with our youthful innocence where we cast of the defensive barriers that at time result in us so easily connecting to ways that aren't necessarily in harmony with our soul's truest desires, is a real challenge. Especially when our desires press from within us so intensely at times. It takes courage to remain resolved to have that you TRULY desire even in the face of the seeming adversity and pressure of something that comes from within us. By applying patience and developing a more solid resolve, however, we psychically trasmit to the universe our truest intentions, thus begin to attract the desires that are more in harmony with our natures. Nature cannot be
-separated from being. We each vibrate at a different rhythm no matter how connected we all are. Our angle as angels has specific purpose. Certainly live the life that you choose. All I am saying is that something in what you said suggests a lack of core integrity. I'm certain that if given the option, most of us would choose a profound intimate with one person versus many relationships that may fall very short of providing that sense of external fulfillment that we truly desire, we would choose the one relationship. This doesn't mean that we don't experience "relationship" with other people of the same and opposite sex. It does mean, however, that we use better discernment and judgement in our dealings as we understand ourselves much better. Judgment isn't as bad as people make it out ot be. We are supposed to judge for ourselves. Ego isn't as terrible as people make it out to be. I love my ego. It is a tool for making my way through the world. Balancing it out with understanding of
-general and profound oneness should only make us more accountable and discerning. Be blessed!
I came to the conclusion that if it wasn't working that I was free to try a different approach. The approach I chose was total surrender to the universes love for me. That non of those things good, bad, or otherwise made me more or less valuable to God. The internal struggle with myself left me dis-empowered and unhappy so I stopped struggling and God rose up with in me to support all the positive uplifting things I could share. In shifting my focus I was able to increase the positive in my life and reduce the hold of fear, specifically fear regarding sexuality.
Core integrity with regard to what?
Well your statement said something about how you were suppressing and through suppression, once you gave in, you found that you were more solidified in your yearning (something to that extent). Suppression is something that should certainly be used in moderation, as well as anything else that could lead to a choice being a galling limitation. It's more matter of the mind, however. There are numerous healthy ways to express sexual energy while still preserving one's self. I am not, by any means saying, that one should NOT express sexually. Lord knows I love me some sex dammit. In our choices, however, what is it that we are truly satisfying? That answer is different for everyone, although the core truth may be the same for many. Becoming more solidified in satisfying the longing of the flesh after supression generally shows that there is something on the level of the belief, thoughty and psyche that needs an adjustment. With this being the case, therein is where solution should be
-sought. Energy can be exhausted in many ways, and truly one way or another, an energy pattern must be allowed to exhaust in such a way that leads to greater enlightenment. This suggests that it is on the level of the thought/belief where the solutions are found. It is possible to go within and experience this enlightenment without having to experience the lessons that come from allowing the wheel of furtune to create circumstances that almost force us to change our path. Well, that is easier for some than for others. I know for me, most lessons have come from pushing the envelope. Wisdom, is the result however. It's not about rules for everyone. It's about what's right for me. I am not knocking any lifestyle at all. I like to speak about the myriad possibilities whereas most people I know speak as if their way is the way. Enjoy your life, love. If it's fun, it can't all be bad, can it?
Of course not! This is a grand adventure in which I am choosing to see the possibilities. The resistance issue was one that came up for me in my early 20's. During that time I was in a lot of turmoil trying to connect with the God in me. I have since grown tremendously. I do know that not everything requires direct blunt force trauma to get through my head...lol. I am only exploring the other possibilities available to me. Giving my self permission to be a sexual being has actually reduced the amount of space this component takes up in my mind. Ultimately, my choice to honor all of me has brought me to greater balance. When refusing any part of myself it cries out to be recognized as part of the whole. From my hair, to digestion, to spirit. I hope that the ultimate intention is not lost in my story. Thanks Khari Menra for this fantastic dialog. You have been a wonderful mirror for me.
you know i have something to say about this but i want to let it marinate for a minute like a leg sacrificed lamb and check myself so i can be honest...i'll be back to this...But Thank you!!!!!
Men don't seem to want this because they want to own women. Women don't seem to want this because they want to own men - bottom line. Forget the jargon... With 78% of females non-orgasmic and 63% of married men practicing infidelity, tell me how there is any core integrity in that? Please...It is time for a new way.
I think the real challenge is learning new ways to appreciate what you have. I don't see any men nor women in poly feeling any more fulfilled. They only try to sell it to others as justification for their own compromises. Seeing the gaps in so many of the arguments, I find myself simply refraining from further commenting. I could eat this shit up though.
Agreed. It is difficult to learn to appreciate people when we are not allowed to appreciate our own sexuality and the sensual beauty of ALL others. We are shut down as a people because our core is the sensual nature. We are shut down as a people because our core is Peace itself. Like yin and yang Sensuality (animal Nature) and Peace (God Nature) must be in balance. But we should only appreciate one person right? Appreciation of more is Sinful! LOL! Not to mention appreciation of ourselves, well that's just freaking vain! Pious, chastity, sacrifice, judgment - there are Anglo Christian values, you know the same Victorian, Pious lovelies who raped slave women and neglected their wives. Ha Ha Ha! So much for Anglo Christian values! Love is not an animal...Love is an attribute of God itself. We should love freely and often... By the way, maybe it was the Anglo Christian pious, chaste ones who demonized sex and called it lust in the first place? Sex is connection to the divine
Your take on what people are saying about appreciating is exaggeratedly extreme. There are many ways to appreciate people than sexually. I can't go too much into it. If you truly desire to hear my views, we can talk about it on the phone. I can with a tremendous amount of precision show you the gaps in the integrity of your missives and expressions on the topic. I'm not in any way saying you should change because of what I veiw. I'm just saying when some shit lacks some core integrity, it lacks it. It's plain as day to me. I'm sure, if you are as open as you say you are, you will find what I have to share quite enlightening. Arcaic revelations aren't anything to fear babes.
For more articles on open relationships - see my blog - http://jujumama.wordpress.com I was listed today on www.TantraExplorer.com as most relevant articles on Poly. Check it out! Thanks Suruma! Great topic. If you are in Atlanta we are having a cocktail party to discuss this topic - do join us - send me a message for an invite.
and don't get so stuck on the whole christian piece either. There are many who don't subscribe to christian views, but who do subscribe to very fundamental principle who could eat this shit up to just on the lack of structural integrity of what is being communicated.
I don't fear archaic revelations, it's just that those who received the revelations were having sex with young boys and African women and ignoring their own wives. Archaic is not the problem, outdated is not the problem, the issue is that this crap does not and has never actually worked. But I know how difficult it is for a man to envision HIS woman laying up with some dude. Therein lays the problem...yes?
If we are talking about structural integrity - let's discuss the stats I listed earlier - any takers? Tell me why 68% of American men cheat - they don't appreciate what they have? Why are 78% of American women non-orgasmic in bed with a man (with their toys maybe they are cool) is it that they don't appreciate his phallus? And why the failing marriages at 55% how integrated is that? Not to mention the 82% of American kids who live in broken, dysfunctional homes...so much for structural integrity of monogamy. I am not suggesting poly as an only alternative, I am just saying what structural integrity you speak of?
Again, what structural integrity do you speak of?
I wasn't referring to those forms of arcaic revelations, sweets. In fact, I meant arcane. lol... My bad. But I could care less about what some controlling old farts from some other era subscribed to. I don't believe the answer is a quantum leap to the other end of the spectrum. I believe that the real solution is in raising our standards to a higher level of accountability, not forcing on ourselves beliefs and lifestyles that no matter how hard we try, we can't even honestly say that we are TRULY in agreement with. Again, I can go into the plethora of gaps within your perspective WITH PRECISION. I choose to be a bit more respectful and allow principle to show that which may currently difficult for you to see. I'm not afraid to talk about it thought. I'd much rather you request my perspective rather than slaughter all that could be slaughtered.
I would also caution us to look a little deeper than the physical aspect of relationships when trying to figure out why men cheat, why women are not orgasmic and why marriages are failing. Maybe we're putting our energies in places that aren't as productive as others and throwing the proverbial baby out with the bathwater.
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